Atheists Are Comming For Your Children – The Podcast
By Dave Hitt on Sep 16, 2008 in QH Podcasts
The latest episode of The Quick Hitts Podcast is now available. It’s titled “Atheists Are Coming For Your Children, but it’s not just a simple rehash of this post. In fact, it contradicts it. In the conclusion of that post I said fundies would be powerless to stop us from converting their children. But after giving it some thought I realized there are some things they can do to make their kids less susceptible to the influence of us Evil Atheists. I explain them in this episode. Not that I expect any of them to listen.
Feel free to use the comments section of this post to heap praise or derision on the show.
This is one of the best Quick Hitts you’ve done. It was dead on right. They are their own worse enemy. Fill a kid’s head with outrageously unbelievable mythology and no ability to reason. then see what happens when they hit reality.
I think you’re also right about not saying anything about atheism until they open the door by discussing God.
I’m glad we could smartenize you about the Ritalin. If only I could get you to stop going on about smoking.
Bryan | Sep 19, 2008 | Reply
Well, I came here to convey how wrong I thought you were on pretty much everything in this podcast. Well, at least you will have one pro and one con post, eh? I have a lot to say so we will see if this system can let me post as much as I have to say.
Chapter 1
I would like to start by saying that I do consider myself a Christian but could hardly call myself a practicing Catholic, as I have not participated in a church activity since I was at my first daughters Baptism almost 20 years ago. I have not renounced my religion, but could probably say I have outgrown it as I still hold the Ten Commandments as a meaningful basis for my moral structure.
Atheists banter usually do not bother me. Most of my atheist friends are not the mocking type and it usually does not come up, but every so often I see a bumper sticker or some article that seems to be spiteful against religion just for the sake of it. This podcast started to cross the line from your usually tone into this territory. Kinda like the Jimmy Carter rip a while back. :)
Most of these insults that do bother me are usually based on the, “All religion is Evil” line of thought. They point out things like Radical Islamic actions or the Crusades as proof of how religion can only result in tragedy because of the level of “lack of rational” that it takes from it’s participants to be involved in religion to begin with.
But have any of you stopped to think of of the other side of that argument? Name the most peaceful groups of people in the history of mankind. There are pathetically few Peace full societies in mankind, but all most all of them are Religious sects that are Fundamentalists with a capital F. The Amish, the Hindu/Buddhist monks ect.
I fear your personal grievances (and dare I say ego) a clouding your rational. Religion is a tool, just like a gun. If you stockpile a lot of it in your home you will either end up with a bloodbath or the home least likely to be bothered by outside violence. Any tool cannot be inherently evil or good, just a pawn to it’s owners whims. Should I expect you to start calling gun owners foolish or gullible?
Chapter 2
So people that preach religion bother you. Do you really thing that taking them out of church would make them bother you less? Is what is bothering you is that persons mannerisms or message? Would a Jehovah Witness at you door bother you more than the insurance salesmen throwing his pitch to everybody at the party?
I ask because the more I talk to Atheists, the more I get the feeling that they are not as much bothered by the idea that somebody created us, but by the idea of the Divinity of that being. That sounds like an ego issue to me. Kinda like how far leftists cannot wrap their heads around the idea that there are things on this planet that we have no control over.
I tend to intertwine my Religious beliefs with rational science. I doubt Jesus was resurrected and that the world was created in 6 days or is 6k years old. That God created man with idea of a woman is also kinda unrealistic.
However, where science is unsure of or is coincidently similar I will go with my religious ideals until something further is proven. We are still missing a link in the evolution of mankind, the Bible speaks many time of a woman from the stars as Adams mate, works for me. Kill 2 birds with one stone, fits a unknown change in the DNA of man and scripture.
Thousands of years of written examples really is better scientific proof than discounting an idea that comes from outside your orthodoxy. narrow mindedness is not exclusive to religion.
Religion can and is a great tool for those in need. Many troubled individuals need something to help them though tough times. It is hardly a crime to need guidance in life and most of the time it is completely benign. It is usually when it turn political that things go bad. That is not an indictment on religion, but on mans desires. Maybe we should be happy for those who find their niche in life instead of mocking them. Who here does not have a few guilty pointless if not self-destructive pleasures in life?
South park once famously did a total hatchet job on the Mormons. They pointed out every retarded belief and ridiculous notion when the new kid in town shared his beliefs. But at the end of the episode, the New kid replied.
“Look, maybe us Mormons do believe in crazy stories that make absolutely no sense, and maybe Joseph Smith did make it all up, but I have a great life. and a great family, and I have the Book of Mormon to thank for that. The truth is, I don’t care if Joseph Smith made it all up, because what the church teaches now is loving your family, being nice and helping people. And even though people in this town might think that’s stupid, I still choose to believe in it. All I ever did was try to be your friend, Stan, but you’re so high and mighty you couldn’t look past my religion and just be my friend back. You’ve got a lot of growing up to do, buddy. Suck my balls.”
Religion obviously brings out the worst in you. Kinda like me and Portuguese porn.
Chapter 3
Now, the serious stuff. I know you prescribe to the theory of sexuality being genetically based but you are partially mistaken and tread waters that could be dangerous.
I will not discount Sexual confusion on a genetic level just because of the science of human gender selection. All embryos start off as female and wait for a chemical to start a gender transformation to male. It is completely rational to see how a bit too little or a bit to much of said chemical could affect a persons gender transformation. But that is not always the case.
My oldest Daughter turned 21 on sept 13th, the came out as a lesbian at the age of 17. He mother came out as a lesbian at age 26, when my daughter was 10 years old. Me and her mother were both young and separated before we knew she was pregnant.
He mother was a classic case of a girl sexually molested as a child by her stepfather and promiscuous at a very young age, even trying prostitution before she was even 16.
My daughter grew up in households with 2 mothers and it was not till she came out to me that I had learned what had happened. She also had become sexually active at age 12 and was barely watched over by her mother. I had to go with the police to a under age club to get her when she was 14 after my neighbor called me an told me they saw he mother drop her off there. It was a 16-21 club.
Long story short my daughter followed the only path she had presented during her puberty and initiation to the sexually world, her mothers. She is a work in progress now, she did get through college and is looking at the Police force as a career. But she can rationally see how she ended up on this deviant path, but is now to emotionally bound to leave it. I know many girls like this.
These are the people than can be “rescued” from the lifestyle, not everybody, but some. For them is a sad existence for those who see others with what they want, husbands and families. But do not have skills or self confidence to reach out and get it. Relationships are a LEARNED skill. if you do not have a solid background in it you chances of success are slim. This just keeps them in an unhappy existence. Just like a battered wife or child or Drug addict struggling to shake the bonds. As men we sometime overlook how important the family structure is to women and how much they will forgo to keep together whatever dysfunctional one they have.
I believe it was the movie PCU that made the perfect joke of the lesbian in training being escorted by the sisterhood. Always interfering if the new girl started to talk to a man at a bar. I and anybody between the ages of 20-40, have experienced this.
Oh, the Dangerous part? Can you imaging the impact on the legal system if Sexual Orientation as a Genetic basis becomes truly acceptable? Imagine Rapists and Pedophiles being able to make a legal argument that they are not in control of their sexual desires, therefore not responsible for their behaviors? Rape and child molestation would become practically nonpunishable once a precedence was set, because any attack on those would have to be defended to protect the whole ideal.
Don’t believe that? just look how Partial-Birth and Late-term induced Abortions are tolerated to keep the abortion ideal protected.
Still love the show and keep up the good work!
P.S. I had a friend who was a bit on the scrawny side due to his lack of physical training as a child. He decided to bulk up and started taking steroids and going to the gym.
To this day he still swears by the steroids, but I wonder if he ever thought that had he bothered to do the training earlier in his life if he would have needed the Steroids now.
P.S.S. Ok, I made that up.
P.S.S.S. Yes it is an analogy of the Ritalin.
P.S.S.S.S Have a nice day!
Mike Medina | Sep 19, 2008 | Reply
Mike,
There are good religious people and bad religious people. Just like there are good and bad atheists or any other group of people. For that matter there are bad aspects to your examples of peaceful religious fundamentalists.
I think the problem is the compulsion to force one’s religious beliefs on others. Keep your religion to yourself and we’ll keep our atheism ourselves. For every offensive atheist bumper sticker you see I can probably find five offensive Christian stickers. I don’t think we would have such a vocal atheist community if not for a backlash against the extremism of the religious community.
Your daughter’s story is a nice anecdote, but it provides no evidence to support your claim. I seen more and more credible studies that reinforcing the fact that sexual orientation it’s not a “choice”.
P.S. Try to make your more clear, it’s point is lost on me.
Bryan | Sep 22, 2008 | Reply
Mike, thanks for taking the time to craft that reply. I think it’s a bit longer than the original podcast, so I’ll only comment on a few of your points and let the rest stand, or let someone else address them.
I see more considerably more spiteful religious bumper stickers than atheist ones. “April 1st -National Atheists Day.” “I don’t question YOUR existence – God,” and my favorite, a Jesus fish, labeled “truth” eating a Darwin fish. But snarky bumper stickers don’t prove anything, except that the owner of the vehicle is snarky. I don’t put political or anti-religious bumper stickers on my vehicles, but if I did the snark would be heavy enough to affect my mileage.
The message. They’re spreading ignorance. As for JW door knockers, I have a great deal of fun with them. Check out the “Can I Get A Witness” podcast for details. You see, I used to be one, but I got over it and its all better now.
If the insurance salesman is trying to sell me a whole life policy, he’s just as much of a useless weasel as the preacher. And I’ll have just as much fun at his expense.
Yes it can, and I’d never discuss the issue with someone who needed it at that moment. It wouldn’t be appropriate. It might be, after their crisis passes, but again, I don’t bring up the subject in the meatspace 3D world.
To the best of our knowledge sexual preference is mostly hard wired. It’s not uncommon for younger folks to be confused about a lot of things, who they are, what they want, what their purpose should be, and, occasionally, their sexual orientation. But given time, they’ll figure out it.
As evidence, ask virtually any heterosexual man about his reaction to two guys having sex. Yuck, gross, disgusting. How about two women? Oooh, hot, can I watch? Those reactions are almost universal, and I think it has more to do with the wiring than any outside influence.
Relationships are difficult for anyone to figure out. I don’t think there’s a huge difference between hetro and homo sexual relationships, except they don’t have to deal with that whole seat up / seat down argument. It’s hard to get along with another person all the time, no matter what their gender.
I do think pedophiles are hard wired to want to have sex with kids. But that doesn’t excuse their behavior. If someone has a short temper, they can’t use that as an excuse for violence. We hold them responsible for their behavior. Likewise, if someone wants to have sex with children, it is up to them to control their desires. If they turn it into action the full force of the law can and should slam them, hard.
Hittman | Sep 23, 2008 | Reply
Bryan, the whole point was that maybe Dave should ease up on the Religious bashing a bit. It is obvious he had family issues with Religion and it brings out a bitter streak in him. To me it sounds no different than the Brady family ranting against Guns.
I understand when it becomes political it is a problem but there is a fine line between honest criticism and taunting.
But, considering how you can just agree with me about how religion can be a useful force for good, then revert right back to religion as “Spreading ignorance” in a later paragraph. I can see that you may have out grown your religion but have not yet out grown your need to ridicule those who feel different.
I really like the ideals of your podcast but I am starting to have the same issue with you as some of my Libertarian friends. They believe in the structure and Ideals of Libertarianism, but do from a selfish point of view, not one of wishing for the best for others.
They seem to see Libertarianism as a mental contest to see who of them can pin the biggest L on there chest by spouting ideas like Anarcho-Capitalism. I will admit to leaning to the right because I believe that you can’t separate morality from law completely. There is no law structure strong enough to resist an electorate with bad intentions. I think we are living through that right now as we speak.
I always seem to find myself a bit outside of every group as a person in general so this is not surprising to me in the least. I guess that makes me either Profoundly visionary or Profoundly Idiotic. I could live with either, I just think I like to know were I fall.
Mike Medina | Sep 25, 2008 | Reply
Well, I am going to change the subject here. My comment is a nit picker. The belief that there is not a “God” is no more rational than the belief that there is a God. Either position is a “belief” that requires faith. You can neither prove nor disprove the existence of God. Those that believe that you can usually have put God in a box. I was raised in what would now be called a fundamentalist Christian church and I did not buy it then, but for the same reason I do not buy atheism. For awhile I was a theist, but lately I find myself an agnostic as this seems to be the only position that is based on reason.
Don Venardos | Sep 28, 2008 | Reply
I don’t believe the Easter Bunny exists. Is that irrational?
Hittman | Sep 29, 2008 | Reply
No, Mr. Hitt, but if you DO believe that the Easter Bunny DOESN’T exist, you’re being irrational. It may sound like a pointless semantic argument, but it makes all the difference in the world.
What I believe Mr. Venardos was alluding to is that you cannot prove something doesn’t exist, you can only fail to prove that it does. Ask any research scientist. We haven’t proved that angels don’t push a thrown ball through the air — only that momentum offers a more reasonable and practical explanation.
You’re welcome to infer whatever you like from lack of proof on a personal level, and it’s often most practical to treat it as a very strong indicator that something doesn’t exist. I’m perfectly comfortable with the ideas that angels are NOT in fact pushing every object through the air. However, it’s a logical error to assume that lack of proof and proof of lack are equal. If we’re trying to tout logic and science over faith and religion, we should try to do it logically and scientifically, don’t you think?
Justin Kerns | Oct 3, 2008 | Reply
Very eloquently spoken Mr. Kerns.
Dave, what I said is, “The belief that there is not a “God†is no MORE rational than the belief that there is a God.” I didn’t say that either one was irrational.
It appears you believe that because we can apply the scientific method to our universe and can come to understand it means that there is not a “God”. You could just as easily make the argument that it means that there is a “God”. Neither position is more rational than the other. I think the case against the Eater Bunny is a little more substantial.
Perhaps you have equated the belief in God with a belief in the literal truth of scripture?
Don Venardos | Oct 9, 2008 | Reply
No, Don, I recognize that a lot of believers are not literalists.
What case is there against the easter bunny? Unlike god, both he and Santa leave actual evidence behind.
If you can’t prove unicorns exist, then it’s perfectly reasonable to conclude they don’t. The same goes for any other mythical creatures. The burden of proof falls on the one making the claim. When no one can provide even the slightest sliver of proof of something, it’s perfectly logical to conclude it doesn’t exist.
Dave Hitt | Oct 10, 2008 | Reply
Dave,
We both know that we are just arguing semantics here, but in the case of the easter bunny, you go outside early on easter sunday and see lots of parents putting out eggs. In the case of the creation of the universe we explain most things after the creation, but if you believe in God or you don’t, either way it is a miracle (it defies reason). Where did the initial substance that started the universe come from? Well, either it was always there or it was created by a god. Either one you can put in your pipe and smoke. Whereas with a mythological creature we aren’t dealing with the unknowable origin of something that we experience daily.
Don Venardos | Oct 16, 2008 | Reply